Forum: Race Committee & Race Management

Series scoring with entries that did not sail

David Arty
Nationality: United States
I have a question that came up from another competitor at the end of our 10 race spring series. The competitor (A) did not make the first two races and was scored DNC. Our SI’s state that “A boat that did not come to the starting area (DNC) shall be scored points for the finishing place one more than the number of boats entered in the series.”

Another competitor (B) registered just before race 9. Both race 9 and 10 were abandoned for weather, so she did not sail any races in the series. 

Competitor A asserts that since B did not register until race 9, and did not sail any races in the series, A’s DNC’s in races 1-2 should be scored based on the number of boats excluding B. This would improve his place in the series by 1 position. 

My read is that B met the conditions of entry, so although she did not compete in any races she counts as an entry. Rule A2.2 states that “If a boat has entered any race in a series, she shall be scored for the whole series”, which I take to mean that all DNC’s count as if she was there the whole time. Am I missing anything that would actually result in A being scored better?
Created: Yesterday 22:05

Comments

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Angelo Guarino
Forum Moderator
Nationality: United States
That's an interesting question. I would interpret "entered" in the series being the number that existed at the moment the race to be scored DNC started and should not dynamically change as the weeks go by. 

At the time of the start of race 1,  how many were entered? Then the same for race 2.  If others enter later ... it should not change race 1 and 2 (that's how I would do it). 

But ... JMO ... for a series that spreads over weeks ... where you have late entires and people not showing up for all the races ... it seems to me fairer to score DNC based on the number of starters or the number of finishers ... not the number of entries. Either one of those approaches handles that situation automatically. 
Created: Yesterday 22:10
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Michael Butterfield
I think as the enrty was valid, and the boat would have sailed had the races been held it should be counted.
I contrast this with entries before an event when the boats do not turn up to sail when they should be discounted. 
Created: Yesterday 22:21
Eric Rimkus
Nationality: United States
50
Tips
It seems that when race(s) 1 & 2 (and for that matter 3 - 8) were scored the number of entries for the series was "X-1" and the DNC for race 1 & 2 should reflect that. When races 9 & 10 were scored the number of entries was "X" and had those races not been abandoned would have been scored as such. 
You are essentially going back and rescoring races 1-8 as a result of an entry in race #9 as directed by RRS A2.2 so that seems to be correct, even though it doesn't seem fair.
Created: Yesterday 22:37
Wayne Balsiger
Nationality: United States
For the future, you may want to look at the US Sailing comments on scoring a Long Series.  This is noted at the end of Appendix A.  Go to ussailing.org/rules and select 'Scoring a Long Series'.

My club uses DNC = number of finisher plus 2.  DNS = number of finishers plus 1.
Created: Today 03:07
Jim Champ
All scoring systems are imperfect, all we can do is apply the rules as written. Electronic systems I've seen treat all interim results as provisional, and any score may change, letter scores particularly. This has the advantage that in the end all DNCs have the same points, which would seem more logical than DNC points changing if more boats enter as the series progresses or varying in races with different numbers of starters. 

If you consider a club series in which boats enter the series by signing on for a race then one might have to score 5 entries and no DNCs for race 1, 20 entries  and 5 DNCs for race 10, and 5 entries and 25 DNCs for race 20, which with low point scoring would be ridiculous! 

I think if a boat enters a series according to club rules/procedures then she must be scored DNC for all races even if she never actually launches. If the club wishes to say only give DNC scores to boats who have come to the starting area in at least one completed race then they need to write that into the SIs/NOR. 

So seems to me the boat was correctly scored. 
Created: Today 04:53
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John Allan
Nationality: Australia
David, Are you saying that your NOR did NOT  state a date and time for entries to close before the B's entry for Race 9 was received?
Created: Today 04:59
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